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teresChapter Thirty-Seven (Part I) | Table of Contents | Chapter Thirty-Seven (Part III)
SCSF: A good day, everyone, and welcome back to BattleAxe! Last time, we reached Jervois Landing and we heard about Timozel inexplicably beginning to turn evil. For the reader post:
On chapter 21, in conversation with Maegwin, I note that the lack of sex supposedly being a dealbreaker for Champions seems like a jab at religious devotion.
Maria Monk Redux: 72
On part I of this chapter, Wolfgoddess notes that the mule should not have such trouble getting through the snow, even with Faraday on its back.
Did Not Do the Research: 67
I also note that, when Jack bids the others his leave, we have “Then” as a sentence on its own, which I doubt Douglass meant to do.
PPP: 380
With that, let me resume! As I said last time, I am planning to do things a little differently now, and so I will cover the rest of this chapter in one go. I will also cover the rather boring (I find) part first, and then the less boring part, lest I lose my motivation altogether.
We open on everyone going down to the ferry. By the time they reach it, the ferryman is about to go home for the day, but sees Faraday, Yr, and Timozel approaching. He does not like that, as he wanted to go home early before the weather deteriorates further. …Given that Jack could disappear in the snow quite quickly just now, how far away can they really be? Sure, the ferryman is supposed to be unreasonable, but I get the distinct impression that Douglass forgot about the visibility.
Did Not Do the Research: 68
He almost thinks to push off in any case, but then see Timozel’s sword, and tells his “three assistants” to wait, since it would be better not to “anger one of Borneheld’s captains”. That is a sound rule to follow, but it still sounds like Borneheld’s captains are especially quick to anger, presumably because they serve Borneheld. I also wonder just why this ferryman needs three assistants? This is not a particularly hard place to cross, and the raft does not seem that large, either, so I am not sure of this is correct.
Petty Ain’t the Word for You: 64
So Timozel comes closer, and the ferryman sees he is actually an Axe-Wielder, so he makes the Sign of the Plough, and offers Timozel passage while talking about how he is surely “keen to reach [his] rooms this night”. When he sees Faraday and Yr, the ferryman immediately thinks that they are both “very beautiful”, but he likes the “blonde wench” just a little better. If Douglass had not put lots of emphasis on the looks of the protagonists, and if she had made an effort to keep misogyny out of this book, I might take this. As it is, it seems more than a little hypocritical of Douglass. Over to Yr, she “dip[s] her eyes coquettishly” at the ferryman, thinking that it never hurts to “turn a man’s mind from money to lust”, and she has no idea how Timozel will pay the ferryman when they reach the other side (I am sure he would be able to get something done, being an Axe-Wielder). It turns out that the ferryman wants to get “his gold” right now, though.
So he grovels at Timozel’s side, calling him “[m]y lord” and smiling, which gives us a note about his “stained teeth”. He says that for him and “the two lovely ladies”, it is only “four marks”. To get across. Then he puts on a sad look and says he is sorry the price is that high, but it just costs that much to “hire decent help to work this ferry in such bad weather”, and he is sure that Timozel will understand.
Well, the ferryman is actually trying to do something bad, and he is somewhat subtle about it, so credit for that. That said, talking about his “stained teeth” does not help convince me that he is untrustworthy, Douglass; it rather comes across as pettiness yet again.
Petty Ain’t the Word for You: 65
He is also being sexist, and I do dislike him for that, but it is rather rich to make us dislike him for calling them “lovely ladies” when it is supposed to be fine when Jack does it! If Douglass were trying to show her double standards, this would be a good way to do it.
Looking further… “four gold marks” does sound expensive, so that is fine. For the name, there have been gold marks, though it seems to have been a specifically German currency. Also, I see that this will never come up again; there are “marks” in Beyond the Hanging Wall, but there is no indication if they are gold. Given this, I think some more thought should have been put into this currency.
Gold-Star Worldbuilding: 91
Then… why does he actually have three assistants? I could buy one assistant given the weather, though I think changing places would be better for that, but three seems quite unnecessary, and means he needs to have twice as much money. Then again, he might just keep the greater part of it to himself, but that just makes me wonder why his assistants wouldn’t go for something more lucrative, not to mention that this means more people who might talk about him. It just does not make much sense to do things this way.
Ill Logic: 219
Finally, why does he think doing this with an Axe-Wielder is a good idea? There is a good chance that Timozel might talk about this in Jervois Landing and get him in trouble, after all.
Ill Logic: 220
Douglass really did not think this through, I am sure. Well, Timozel smiles, which reassures the ferryman, but then he grabs him by the throat and “half lift[s] him off his feet”! Timozel says that the ferryman must not have recognised Lady Faraday, betrothed to Borneheld, who is on her way to her wedding. He asks if the ferryman would want him to tell to Borneheld himself that he was “churlish enough to demand payment from her” as she hurried to her lord, and the ferryman’s, as he adds to “drive the point home”. During this, his “pleasant smile never waver[s]”.
That… well, Timozel ostensibly does it for Faraday, and I do like that he does not like that they have to pay at all, instead of that the ferryman tried to rip them off; it fits with how he is supposed to be. I am not so sure about his threat; yes, Borneheld might just get angry at that, but he has a war to be fighting, and the ferryman knows that very well indeed. And that is not to mention that he’s living right at the edge of Ichtar; if he wants to, he could switch out Borneheld for Isend right now, so the threat falls quite flat.
That aside, this feels quite weird from Timozel. I would expect this from a “badass” character, and Timozel has not been shown to care for that at all. In the same vein, I also wonder why Timozel does not put his authority as an Axe-Wielder in play, since the ferryman recognised that, or why he does not bring up that he is a Champion. Yes, Douglass probably did this to make him look more menacing, and it does work… but if she wants to write about Timozel turning to evil bit by bit, then it needs to be about Timozel doing that, which should be informed by who he is.
PPP: 381
I finally note that he only talks about Borneheld, not about Axis, so it seems he is shifting his loyalties. I can see it—via Faraday he has more ties to Borneheld than he now has to Axis, after all—but I wonder if it is supposed to be another sign that Timozel is turning evil (probably so).
Well, the ferryman’s reaction is to think about how he has “never seen a less pretentious escort” for who Timozel is claiming to be Borneheld’s betrothed (so much for everyone recognising her, it seems), and that Yr is dressed in “country worsted”. Then he decides to “put on a brave aspect” in front of his assistants, and tells Timozel that his wife dresses better than “that girl”, and he hardly thinks she is “the Duke’s betrothed”.
PPP: 382 (improper capitalisation)
…While I can certainly sympathise with this attempt, doing it when Timozel is holding him by the throat strikes me as rather unwise and counterproductive, especially if it involves insults, like here. At this, Faraday sensibly goes to show the ferryman her ring, but before she can do anything, Timozel gets angry and grabs the ferryman so tightly he “[gives] a strangled sound”. The three assistants, who we are told are “all young lads”, are kept back by a single glare from him. That went about as well as could have been expected, though I am glad to see that Timozel’s actions do line up with what we know of him again, and that we are seeing some seriously misguided devotion, too! It still is ridiculous that he was apparently corrupted by Gorgrael in the span of some weeks, but it does fit with that, and I will take it.
Timozel then whispers “so threateningly the ferryman [thinks] he [is] dead” that he thought he heard the ferryman say he did not believe him, and that he “may even have insulted the lady by comparing her to [his] wife”, and he does not like that! …Why does he care about the ferryman not believing him before he gets to the insult to Faraday?
Ill Logic: 221
Faraday now looks at Timozel “in amazement”, as do I somewhat. Even if I accept that his dream of Gorgrael has begun to turn him evil, this seems like something that should be quite a bit further along in the trilogy. I would first expect some small things to show that Timozel is not doing well, like picking a fight with this ferryman, and then this would be the point where he loses control for the first time, which I would put somewhere at the end of this book. The problem is that there has been not much leading up to this; the most we got was Timozel being distrustful about the way Jack treated Faraday, which was before Gorgrael sent his dream; after that… we have nothing, and two weeks later, he is suddenly threatening people with death when they insult Faraday. A significant chunk is missing here!
PPP: 392 (+10)
At this, the ferryman “squeaks in fear” and says that he misunderstood and Timozel can have a free passage, after which Timozel drops him. The man cowers on the deck for a moment, then crawls away on “his hands and knees” and tells his assistants to pole. …This is not something I would want to see just for someone trying to rip off our protagonists, so credit to Douglass for reinforcing just how bad Timozel was acting just now (I have a suspicion that is only because he is supposed to turn bad, though). As the ferry pulls away, Faraday calls Timozel out on how “much force” he used; Timozel turns to look at her and she steps back. Then his expression softens, but his voice stays hard as he says that no one insults her before him and gets away with it, and the ferryman is lucky to still live. Maybe it is time to take this more seriously, then? We now get this:
“If this is what you do to win us passage across the Nordra, then I dread to think what you will do to win us a bed for the night,” Yr grumbled.
Well, she does have reason to; if he threatens to kill people in Jervois Landing, it would most probably cause considerably more trouble than it did with the ferryman, which they can hardly afford. Sure, Faraday might be recognised by some of Borneheld’s troops, if they attract their attention, but it is hardly worth the trouble, I would think. So maybe, Yr, you should do something to prevent this from happening?
Ill Logic: 222
Come to that, I notice that she did nothing just now to stop Timozel. Faraday did not do very much either (since Douglass apparently wanted the scene to play out in full), but she tried to show the ferryman her ring, at least, and she called Timozel out on his behaviour, too.
Morals for Thee But Not for Me: 118
Finally, this paragraph could certainly be funny, but it is not after Timozel threatened to kill someone! (And if Yr is meant to be unaware of the gravity of the situation, I am not seeing any indication of that.)
Tone Soap: 43
--
We open on Douglass telling us that “bed and a promise of transport” will be arranged more easily than any of them thought. That is good to hear; I would love for the story to get somewhere soon! So, the ferryman docks at Jervois Landing’s main street and makes Timozel, Yr, and Faraday disembark as quickly as possible. As Timozel walks past, he mouths a curse, but makes sure to keep out of sight as he does so. At least he has some sense about him?
Even though it is dark, the main street is quite busy, and we learn that Faraday has only arrived “just in time”, as the “last major contingent” bound for Gorkenfort has arrived that morning, and is scheduled to leave in two days. So… if Faraday and co. had had worse weather on the way to Fernbrake Lake, they might well have missed that altogether and have arrived at Gorkenfort long after Axis. They have been quite lucky to have made it, then, and it only makes me think even less of Jack and Yr’s plan. Yes, they might not have known exactly when the troops left, but Yr, at least, would have had an idea…
Well, she and Faraday now stick close to Timozel to avoid “lewd suggestions” that the “rough soldiers” throw their way. Timozel gets angry at the “insults”, but has the sense to realise that he cannot “attack the entire street of soldiers passing by”. Then he stops a local, who he sees is a merchant by his fine clothes, and he asks him for an inn they can stay the night. The man laughs, says there is no room to be found “for gold or threat” tonight, and asks if Timozel cannot say that Jervois Landing is “crawling with troops”. He then grins at Faraday and Yr and says they might be able to find themselves a warm place, “if they’re prepared to work a little for it”, but he is afraid Timozel will have to sleep out on the streets.
Thoughts:
- I rather doubt the merchant’s last assertion. Given that Faraday and Yr can apparently get themselves a warm night via sex work, and given that a whole new contingent of troops came in this morning, I am sure that Timozel would be able to find similar employment, too. This does make sense coming from the merchant, as gayness, from what I have seen, is looked down on in this society, but in a place which is far from home for most soldiers, I think it will be stopping less of them than it otherwise might.
- I also note that having a character we are obviously supposed to dislike voice this sentiment somewhat undermines the anti-gay messages we got with Gorgrael and such, which I quite like.
- Speaking of dislike, I do dislike this merchant quite a bit, especially the way he addresses Faraday and Yr, which is as much that he tells them to do sex work for a warm night’s sleep as that he does not even address them when talking about them. That aside, his reply to Timozel also grates quite a bit with me; as far as I know, Timozel has not been here before, so for all he knows, there is a place for them to stay, even if Jervois Landing is so busy with soldiers. Mocking him for not knowing that there is not is not something I like at all. All in all, Douglass did get what she wanted out of this character, which I do appreciate.
Well, Faraday immediately grabs Timozel by the arm and tells him that the merchant “does not realise who [they] are”, and then asks him not to lose his temper here. Good on her for proactively defusing the situation! Timozel does not like this at all, but decides to obey and waves the man away. Good on him for deciding that a direct request from Faraday supersedes his general duty and for not getting angry; that would most probably have caused more trouble than it is worth. …And here I would like to stop for the moment (and, indeed, for this time), and circle back to the beginning, now that I have covered the rather boring part on a detail level.
So, this section actually opens on Timozel, Faraday, and Yr just after Jack has left. Timozel leads the way, and Faraday and Yr hold on to the mule’s packs to keep from being “separated in the snowstorm”. …When did we get a snowstorm? Yes, it snowed quite heavily just now, and there was wind, but that hardly makes a snowstorm, and we do need to know about it if the weather changed. That is not to mention that the next segment does not show the effects of a snowstorm at all.
PPP: 393
Faraday and Yr are both crying in the privacy the snow and their “hooded cloaks” give them. With Yr, it is because most of the Sentinels have been apart for some “two thousand years”, and they only feel whole when they are together, so it is quite painful for her. I really wish we had had something like this earlier; this is rather important characterisation to have for the Sentinels, after all! It does explain much of why Jack and Yr do not seem very attuned to each other, though; after such a long time, they would have been practically strangers.
Faraday, for her part, feels “the loss of a valued companion”, of someone she has “come to lean on for support” in the last few weeks. I can certainly see that, no matter how bad he was to her. She says that after Fernbrake Lake, she let go of her “vague mistrust” toward him, since the Prophecy manipulates “them all” (just what anyone would want, is it not?), and Jack is “as much a victim as she”. That is the impression he gave, but, going by later books, that is not quite what happened; Jack knew the Prophecy of the Destroyer (or most of it, at least) when he agreed to become a Sentinel, and he joined of his own free will. He probably did not understand exactly what it demanded of him, but he is much less of a victim than Faraday is. Even if he were, though, that would have no bearing on how trustworthy he is; all the demands the Prophecy has made of him might leave him rather willing to shift his troubles to Faraday, for example. Combined with his rather bad behaviour so far, I find it rather hard to see this as Faraday finally accepting that Jack is Much Like Her and letting go of her “irrational” mistrust. He just sucks for her, victim or not, and she has every right to dislike that!
She goes on to say that she has lost her mother (so there are some references to that, just not by name) and “the man she loved”, and for a while Jack began to “fill both roles”. Hopefully accidental incest implications aside… does she really care that much about Axis? I got the idea she had a worse time with Merlion’s death than with being unable to see Axis, at least after they started their present journey. Further, how does he exactly fill Axis’s role for her? I do not think we have seen Faraday actually be attracted to him, nor is he all that much like Axis… so I really doubt this. Him standing in for Merlion, on the other hand, confirms what I thought about his role to Faraday… which makes the way he treats her all the worse, of course.
PPP: 394 (unsupported characterisation)
Faraday then says she will “miss him terribly” in the coming months, and how can she “cope with Borneheld” without Jack there? Maybe Yr could help with that? She is as much a Sentinel as Jack, and she will be in a somewhat similar situation to Faraday; combined with her not being as authoritarian as Jack, I get the feeling that she will be of more value for coping than him. Sure, given her views, I doubt it would have a good effect on Faraday, but she would still be more likely to be there for her.
So Faraday grits her teeth, and asks the Mother to aid her, at which she feels “a small twinge of reassurance deep inside her”. She vows to use the sacred bowl if they have a room tonight. That is a nice exchange, I find. Then we cut to a description of the Nordra, which is “wide but slow” where it bends southward. Rivers generally slow as they widen, so why is this posed as a contradiction?
PPP: 395
We learn that “traders and locals” use the ferry to go from Ichtar to Skarabost (and presumably there’s traffic the other way, too), and some stay to use the “river boats” to and from Carlon. Good to know! Then we go into the ferryman’s head, and into the segment I already covered. Let me see if I can get some more out of it the second time. So, he wants to go back to home, but then sees three people on “the path cut deep in the Nordra’s bank”. …I have no idea what that is supposed to be. My first thought was that the bank is quite high here, and so an open tunnel has been cut through it to the river, but that seems like it would be all too much bother for little gain. Because of that, I think this means that the path has been cut horizontally into the bank… though I would still like to know just why.
So the ferryman complains about this, and talks about the storm “thicken[ing]” (I guess that can be used to talk about a snowstorm? It still feels off). He considers pushing off, but does dare to with one of Borneheld’s captains (because Borneheld, and everyone he associates with, are eeevil). Timozel reaches the ferry, the ferryman recognises him as an Axe-Wielder, and, because he is “a religious man”, he makes the Sign of the Plough for him. Given how the ferryman will be treated, that sounds quite a bit like “he was superstitious” to me, especially given that he is mentioned to be religious when that is (still) the default.
Maria Monk Redux: 73
That said… when we see people use the Sign of the Plough, it is nearly always to invoke Artor, not something to greet people with, so I would say the ferryman is being rather superstitious, just not because he thinks a soldier from the religious organisation has religious significance.
The ferryman offers them passage, then thinks about how beautiful Faraday and Yr are. Yr then plays up her sexiness, since she does not know how they will pay the ferryman, and the ferryman tries to get the gold marks from Timozel, which I still find a rather bad plan. I do know that the assistants are “young lads” (presumably to justify why they did not attack Timozel); that does give an advantage, since they are more likely to follow the ferryman’s lead… but it also means that he probably does multiple of them, since they are likely not to be as strong as he is, not to mention that they would be less willing to put up with standing in the snow and wind for long. So… that makes it unfortunately even worse.
Ill Logic: 223
I also note that no one seems to notice that he overcharged them at all; Timozel just gets angry that the ferryman dared to charge them in the first place.
PPP: 395
So then we have the scene of Timozel assaulting the ferryman. On its own, it is not bad, but it hardly fits Timozel, as I have already explained. Looking at it now, though… why does Timozel not use his authority as an Axe-Wielder to make the ferryman do what he wants? Or why not promise payment on the other side, and then just leave? I doubt Timozel would consider it all that much of an “insult” to be expected to pay, after all. Also, Timozel’s threat to tell it to Borneheld only works if the ferryman believes Faraday is actually Borneheld’s betrothed, which he has done nothing to prove, so I have no idea how he expects that to work.
Then the ferryman tries to “put on a brave face” (not that that will help much if Timozel does try to kill him), Timozel hurts him even more until he gives in, and then sets him free.
Ill Logic: 226 (for all of this)
So the ferryman tells his assistants to pole (and calls them “witless idiots”, which I am sure they will appreciate), and Faraday asks if “that much force” was necessary. …Why would any amount of force have been necessary? This, and the whole previous scene for that matter, would work much better if the ferryman were actually dangerous in some way, not just trying to rip them off, and I get the distinct feeling Douglass ripped this off from such a scene in another work.
PPP: 396
In any case, I still think this should be considerably more concerning than it is to Faraday and Yr; Timozel has never done anything like this before, after all!
So they disembark in Jervois Landing, we are told about the new contingent coming in… and then we have the soldiers throwing “lewd suggestions” at Faraday and Yr. Timozel gets angry at that, but does nothing, since he can hardly attack the whole street of soldiers. Hmmm, I get what Douglass is getting at with both this scene and the one with the merchant: she wants to have Faraday and Yr get some sexist moments, without Timozel getting in the way, and she wants to show that Timozel has problems maintaining his anger. I do have some problems with that. First off, I find Faraday and Yr are getting quite enough sexism already, and, if we are going to get it, I would wish for something more than “rough soldiers throw lewd comments” or “slimy men are slimy”. Second, I do not quite like the way in which Timozel is handled here; it comes across like Timozel is unreasonable in getting angry about this sexism, and it means that Douglass is ignoring that he is an Axe-Wielder and that he could easily the merchant off, at least. And third… we already know that Timozel is now prone to uncontrolled anger, so we do not need to see it three times in quick succession. Let us get on with actually finding transport, please!
So Timozel tries to do just that, and gets the sucky merchant instead. He notably gets angry when the merchant calls him “[y]oung man”, which hardly seems like something he would get angry over, and he does not know yet that the merchant means to be insulting, so… that is weird. The merchant has his speech, and Faraday then reacts more appropriately and tells him not to get angry “here”. Would she not mind if he did it elsewhere, then? I can certainly get behind that, and I do like seeing it from Faraday!
Timozel then accedes to Faraday’s request (which I still quite approve of), and then says that he “[does] not know what [they] can do”. …You could ask around for the commander of these soldiers, and then try to get his attention (in which I think showing Faraday’s ring will be helpful). Once you have that, chances are good that the commander would recognise Faraday, or else the ring, and he would have heard of Borneheld getting engaged. Then the commander should be easy to convince to bring Faraday to Gorkenfort, and then the whole problem is solved. So, of course, Timozel manages to put nothing of that together, and they need a deus ex machina to bail them out.
All that, though, will have to wait until next time, as I am finally done with this! Until next time, then!
(no subject)
Monday, 19 May 2025 04:23 (UTC)DID I MENTION THAT FARADAY IS BEAUTIFUL IN THE LAST FIVE MINUTES SHE'S SO BEAUTIFUL YOU GIZE OMG
That's what you sound like, Douglass. That's exactly what you sound like.
This guy being a sexist creep is Not Okay because he's Ugly. Axis is OMG SO HANDSOME so his own sexist creep behaviour is totally okay.
Yeah, this is right out of nowhere. This entire interlude is pointless anyway.
How is he able to talk this much when he's being held up by the throat anyway?
I agree; Timozel's transformation into Evil Timmy is hopelessly rushed, and to make it worse, most of it is dictated rather than shown. Most notably in book two when right out of nowhere we're told that oh by the way he killed a kid while sleepwalking and it nearly drove him mad but never mind that it was never shown or mentioned up until now, at the last fucking minute.
Or rather it just straight-up doesn't exist, pun not intended. Which is pretty damn funny given all the Sapphic overtones that keep slipping into the text.
And we all know this wouldn't have worked on Axis, the walking temper tantrum.
Oh boo fucking hoo, they're finally shot of that gigantic asshole both of you barely knew. Get over yourselves.
Douglass, quit gaslighting your heroine. Her mistrust of that creep was entirely rational, not to mention justified.
YOU KNEW AXIS FOR FIVE FUCKING MINUTES. Christ on a cracker this is ridiculous.
You don't know Borneheld at all yet you're already whining about the idea of being married to him like it's going to be the worst thing ever? Grow up.
Same. It's just so generic and also right out of nowhere.
Most of it from the author.
Same. It's cheap and dishonest and implies that only roughnecks and ugly guys can be sexist. When in reality it can come from just about any quarter, frequently including other women. And given the way Axis behaves, the heavy implication is that it doesn't "count" if the person doing it is highly placed in society and good-looking.
(no subject)
Monday, 19 May 2025 05:48 (UTC)SCSF: It has been quite a while, has it not? At least next time should have more substance...
That's what you sound like, Douglass. That's exactly what you sound like.
That she does... and I find it even more pointless than talking about how "powerful" the protagonists are. Beauty is much more subjective than power, after all. (As a rather obvious example, I find all (naturally-occurring, like the one in my icon) salamanders quite beautiful, but I hardly expect any of my readers does, too.)
This guy being a sexist creep is Not Okay because he's Ugly. Axis is OMG SO HANDSOME so his own sexist creep behaviour is totally okay.
Hmmm, I rather think the beauty is supposed to be a reflection of how they are on the inside, so the ferryman is Ugly because he is Bad... which is just as ridiculous, of course.
Yeah, this is right out of nowhere. This entire interlude is pointless anyway.
(nods) Indeed it is... It keeps us from seeing how they find a way to Gorkenfort, and it would be better to show this change later on anyway.
How is he able to talk this much when he's being held up by the throat anyway?
That was about what I wondered, too, so I will note that next time!
I agree; Timozel's transformation into Evil Timmy is hopelessly rushed, and to make it worse, most of it is dictated rather than shown. Most notably in book two when right out of nowhere we're told that oh by the way he killed a kid while sleepwalking and it nearly drove him mad but never mind that it was never shown or mentioned up until now, at the last fucking minute.
I had recently noted that one, and that absolutely sounds like something to show! Building on that... a quick look through Enchanter does seem to show that his development is not so much rushed as nearly entirely off-page (he is mentioned one-fifth as often as in this book, and Enchanter is longer, for example!). It is a quite poor choice for someone who is relatively prominent in both this and StarMan, but then, I suppose Axis and Azhure must have prominence.
Or rather it just straight-up doesn't exist, pun not intended. Which is pretty damn funny given all the Sapphic overtones that keep slipping into the text.
Does it not? There is this quote from Chapter 7, after all:
Or have this one:
If this is not meant to imply that Isend is (boo! hiss!) gay, then I do not know what it is supposed to be. And, of course, there is Gorgrael and his interactions with Timozel. For that to work, Douglass has to acknowledge somewhat that gayness exists, after all.
Oh yes, all the wailing about how terrible separating is and how horrible Borneheld will be rings rather false, especially since Faraday was quite fine with marrying him before the Sentinels came along. For Yr's part... Jack mostly just complained about her and ordered her around, so I would not imagine Yr would be that sad to miss him, all the more so since she will be seeing him again very soon (on the scale of two thousand years, at least).
Same. It's just so generic and also right out of nowhere.
I think the problems with what Timozel gets angry over actually come from just how generic it is, and I also get the impression Douglass just wanted to have some more violence, because that is "dark". Yes, it does serve some purpose here, but she would have done better to think about what Timozel would do exactly because of that.
Most of it from the author.
(nods) That is what I was thinking of, and it gives me more to work with than the deliberate sexism, so her rather surface-level understanding of the issue goes to show again, I guess.
Same. It's cheap and dishonest and implies that only roughnecks and ugly guys can be sexist. When in reality it can come from just about any quarter, frequently including other women. And given the way Axis behaves, the heavy implication is that it doesn't "count" if the person doing it is highly placed in society and good-looking.
It comes down to "only people who are rough and/or slimy (those you would already expect to be sexist) are actually sexist", does it not? Seen like that, it is obviously quite unhelpful; it does nothing to help the people it is directed at with those they do not suspect of being sexist (who they are naturally more vulnerable to). (I also do not have "rough and/or slimy people" as my usual suspects for sexism, so that is another layer of disconnect.)
(no subject)
Monday, 19 May 2025 10:39 (UTC)Definitely. I remember in my own spork I pointed out that in real life some people think Benedict Cumberbatch is a dreamboat while at least one of my friends thinks he's uglier than a mule's arse. What make it even more ridiculous is that every single woman considered "beautiful" in this stupid trilogy is considered to be that way according to the exact same narrow standards: ALL of them are tall, thin, pale in complexion, and have long luscious hair. Even Shra, who comes from a race of darker-skinned people, is as an adult noted to be "unusually tall and fair-skinned", which just adds some really racist subtext on top of everything else.
And which also doesn't work, because Axis' inner nature is not in line with his outer beauty. The man is a complete monster.
Yeah, it's incredibly obvious that Douglass completely lost interest in Faraday and her entire storyline, because Faraday gets completely sidelined in book two so Azhure, the new favourite doll, can get all the attention. Which means that we barely see Timozel either, since he's always with Faraday. And when we are with Faraday it's all just vague mentions of crap like him having "dark thoughts".
Really, as I said in my own spork, Azhure is one of the biggest factors that destroyed the trilogy in the end. If Douglass hadn't become so OBSESSED with that awful woman and making her as special as possible right out of the blue and then letting her take over the entire plot, it might have been salvagable. As it is, by the end there's barely even any plot unless you count Azhure getting more shinies and special random powers and doing everything important. Which obviously I do not.
It's a truism: Mary Sues are Sues not because they look cool and have cool powers, but because the author lets them warp the world around them so that they get to have it all and never face any consequences. Logic and consistency go straight out the window and the entire story and its setting implode.
It's a tough one because on the one hand that might be the intention, but on the other, stereotypically gay, "unmanly" traits are often unconsciously slapped onto characters we're not supposed to like because the author just assumes that behaving that way is "creepy" or at least worthy of mockery. There's certainly never any acknowledged gay relationships. There's just male characters who are "othered" by their affected lisps and creepy touching and such. The author might well have not even realised she was making them come off as (insultingly and negatively) queer-coded. Certainly very few people realised that was what was going on with a lot of classic Disney villains, and Sara Douglass has never struck me as being self-aware enough to pick up on subtext.
They didn't even give her any concrete reasons to not like the guy, which just makes her look even more stupid and easily led.
That's exactly what it comes down to. As a woman who grew up in about the same time period as this series was being published, that's EXACTLY what girls like me were taught from a very early age. If a man is ugly and creepy-looking, then if he starts making lecherous comments or trying to lay his hands on you, that's awful and he's bad and evil! But if a young, handsome man follows you around without your knowledge, sneaks into your house, stands outside your bedroom window with a boombox, won't take no for anything other than you just playing hard to get, laughs off your discomfort or anger, and a whole lot of other completely unacceptable behaviour, that's "romantic" and he's a good guy who's the one for you. You shouldn't expect him to show you any respect or consideration. Instead just go along with what he wants and you will live happily ever after.
And no, that is not even close to an exaggeration. That is what we're taught and are still being taught. That "Romantasy" bullshit is still reinforcing that garbage. Why else do so many of us end up in relationships with scumbags who reel us in and then start abusing us as soon as we say no? Because we're not being taught how to recognise a scumbag, or how to get away from one.
Just watch. Watch how Axis behaves. How he uses superficial charm to lure in this poor idiot Faraday who's half his age and has no experience. How he later lures in Azhure as well. Then, in both cases, once the woman is in his power, that's when the abuse starts. He rapes Faraday. He rapes Azhure as well. He emotionally abuses both of them, and physically abuses Azhure. And at no point is it ever even suggested that one or both of them might just... you know, LEAVE HIM. It's never a serious consideration. Instead the message is "stay and put up with the abuse. Forever. And have his babies whether you like it or not".
No wonder so many women my age and older are so bitter. At least I'm lucky enough that I had a couple of awful would-be boyfriends and that was it.
(no subject)
Monday, 19 May 2025 20:20 (UTC)SCSF: That was in part 11 of the StarMan spork, I see. Come to that, let me show a picture from 2018, so anyone can judge for themself:
(My own opinion is mostly "looks alright", for the record.)
For the beauty standards... I am reasonably sure that is Douglass projecting her own tastes on the characters, which I do not care for all that much; just let the characters have different tastes than your own, Douglass!
Even Shra, who comes from a race of darker-skinned people, is as an adult noted to be "unusually tall and fair-skinned", which just adds some really racist subtext on top of everything else.
Indeed, and I want to highlight her being tall, since we are specifically told that the Avar women are generally short. I doubt that Douglass meant this, but she does end up showing Shra as beautiful because she is not like the Avar, and that is certainly racist.
Oh yes, he would be better represented by a cartoon demon.
Yeah, it's incredibly obvious that Douglass completely lost interest in Faraday and her entire storyline, because Faraday gets completely sidelined in book two so Azhure, the new favourite doll, can get all the attention. Which means that we barely see Timozel either, since he's always with Faraday. And when we are with Faraday it's all just vague mentions of crap like him having "dark thoughts".
And him having the same visions we have already seen, of course... From what I have seen, Faraday just gets stuck with the evil Borneheld, until he dies, and then she gets to planting? At least Wayfarer Redemption will make her an actual main character...
What makes it even worse is that the Azhure who is stealing the show is nothing like the Azhure we see now; Axis, for all that he is a Stu, follows a somewhat logical progression. If you told me that Azhure was swapped for someone else partway through Enchanter and swapped back for Sinner, I would certainly believe it! Something else that ties into this is how badly she fits with the setting; she might do well as the protagonist of a more whimsical, fairytale-like story (if she was not so incredibly awful, at least), but that does not fit at all with the quite grounded setting of Tencendor (which shows very much in her being able to work certain magic, like destroying Smyrton... just because, I guess). That tone conflict will also be one of the bigger problems with the series going forward, I am sure.
Logic and consistency go straight out the window and the entire story and its setting implode.
(nods) That they do, and this is the worst case I have seen of it. And I note that Douglass pulled off such an "implosion", or at least a drastic change from the previous logic, quite a bit better in Pilgrim and Crusader. I am not sure how well she did it, but I am at least sure that she meant to do it.
Oh, I am sure she did not mean it, I just meant that she did write (probably) gay characters, because she did not think through the implications of the tropes she used. For subtext, it took me a while to train myself to do that, so I can see that, though I think I might expect the best-selling author to be able to know about it and be able to apply it. Oh well, at least it gives us some delightful unintentional stuff...
I did not expect anything else, frankly, and I am not surprised Douglass ended up putting that same attitude in her supposedly "feminist" books, given how utterly superficial the feminism is. I do not like it at all, though it gives us an opportunity to cut into it, at least.
(no subject)
Tuesday, 20 May 2025 10:39 (UTC)I think he's quite nice-looking. Of course, an important factor is that he's got charisma and a lot of it. He also seems to be quite a classy man. For one thing when someone made a rude sexist comment to Scarlett Johansen in an interview, he jumped on them immediately saying "how dare you".
There was no doubt a big wad of wish fulfilment going on there too; without casting aspersions, I've seen photographs of her and she wasn't an exceptionally attractive person. I wouldn't be surprised if she wished otherwise.
Or, if she was a closeted lesbian (she never married and kept putting pretty blatant girl on girl action in this trilogy), maybe women like that were her type. We'll never know.
Oh yeah, the portrayal of the Avar in general is painfully racist but this has to be the most glaring example of it.
Oh yeah, no question. She's likeable enough in book one, but then in book two - BAM - right out of nowhere she suddenly turns into a snotty little princess with a major case of Bitch. I even said in my own spork that the original Azhure died by massive character assassination in that book, and I was right on the money.
Oh yeah, dead right on both counts. Douglass even has the whole "magical songs" thing get dropped. Instead Azhure can just do anything she wants with no explanation as to how and no learning curve of any kind either.
Plus you'll have noticed that the trilogy keeps lurching between grimdark and childish nonsense. A problem the Cycle had too, and just as off-putting.
She probably had no idea why those tropes even existed in the first place.
Oh yeah, when a series is as aggressively hetero as this, one of the biggest sources of fun is finding the accidental HoYay that managed to slip in. Which it pretty much always does. The author's utter cluelessness just makes it even funnier. 🤣
You can tell she was just mindlessly parroting those attitudes she would have grown up with, which I described. Thank goodness things are changing for the better. Mostly. I mean it's definitely a good sign that I've had little girls tell me how dumb it is that people would say "girls shouldn't play sports".
(no subject)
Tuesday, 20 May 2025 19:49 (UTC)SCSF: Well, it seems I had a lot you could find yourself in!
For Cumberbatch... I hardly know anything about him, so I will follow your word in this.
Indeed we will not, and I am just as happy with not knowing. Besides, aside from the constant insistence on how "beautiful" the protagonists are, it does not bother me much; not all the "good" female characters are like that (see the Goodwife Renkin, for instance), so I can hardly speak of a problem. That is one point to Douglass, I suppose.
Oh yeah, no question. She's likeable enough in book one, but then in book two - BAM - right out of nowhere she suddenly turns into a snotty little princess with a major case of Bitch. I even said in my own spork that the original Azhure died by massive character assassination in that book, and I was right on the money.
From what I have seen, that would fit!
I have certainly noticed that, though I think the other pole is a bit more complicated than "childish nonsense"; in the Inheritance Cycle, it is mostly exposition or detours, while here it seems to be mostly twee fairytale stuff. Of the two, the latter puts me off quite a bit more, since it is actively incompatible with the grimdark in a way that the exposition or detours is not.
And yes, that will really break the story. I somewhat wonder if Douglass realised that herself, since I cannot recall her doing anything like that again; sure, there are probably more unexplained abilities, but not to the point of wholly ruining a book.
Oh yeah, when a series is as aggressively hetero as this, one of the biggest sources of fun is finding the accidental HoYay that managed to slip in. Which it pretty much always does. The author's utter cluelessness just makes it even funnier. 🤣
(grins) Oh, me too! I just love to spite (that is probably the right word) the author in such a case, and interpret it as I want to. And yes, the complete lack of awareness makes it all the better!
That does sound better; it is nothing but utter nonsense, after all.
(no subject)
Wednesday, 21 May 2025 11:00 (UTC)Can you name any other examples of a named female character who isn't "beautiful"? (Never mind that "Goodwife" is not a name. She never gets an actual name).
I was mostly referring to the appearance of juvenile wish fulfilment but also stuff like the use of inappropriately cutesy language like "higgeldy-piggeldy" and Gorgrael constantly falling on his ass like a cartoon character.
Paolini's real life obsession with being muscular, wearing a beard and "tough" leather jackets just makes his characters' obsession with rippling male abs and hairy chests all the funnier. He's doing such a great job of making it look like he's wildly overcompensating for his real life forbidden homoerotic desires that it's hard not to just take that as face value for exactly what it looks like.
I mean if nothing else you can probably tell I'm a sex-repulsed asexual because I don't sexualise any of my characters regardless of gender, and most of my POV characters aren't particularly interested in sex. They certainly don't ogle anyone past the point of maybe thinking "wow, he/she is really good-looking".
(no subject)
Wednesday, 21 May 2025 20:06 (UTC)SCSF: I am always up for a challenge, so let me see!
So... after a quick look, I have some examples:
-Sa'Kuya, from Enchanter and StarMan
-Xhosm, from Threshold (a side character who helps our protagonists learn magic)
-Anya, from Beyond the Hanging Wall (another side character who helps the protagonists... escort someone, I think?)
-Hasweb, who I do not think should count, but I do find it interesting that she is not described as beautiful when she is talked about, even though she is the daughter of StarDrifter.
Beyond that, I would submit Gwendylyr; she is described as "lovely" at one point, and I have not checked all her appearances to check if that recurs, but there does not seem to be any kind of emphasis on her beauty.
It is by no means exhaustive, of course, and I am sure I made some errors in it... but I would say I did what you asked for!
I was mostly referring to the appearance of juvenile wish fulfilment but also stuff like the use of inappropriately cutesy language like "higgeldy-piggeldy" and Gorgrael constantly falling on his ass like a cartoon character.
Oh yes, I see what you mean now; I think that will be rather grating indeed when we get to it.
Hmm, for yourself I am not sure if I could tell that? I mean, I already know, so that makes it hard to come at it knowing only your works, but that work is considerably more deliberate than Paolini's, so it is harder to infer much from it. That said, I think I would be able to tell that the person writing it is ace or adjacent to it.
(no subject)
Friday, 23 May 2025 11:05 (UTC)Well I meant just within this trilogy, but fair enough! Does Sa'Kuya (why is she called that? Is she Japanese) really count as an important character? She gets a name, yes, but she only appears in maybe two scenes in the entire trilogy.
You did a good job!
That's true. If homoeroticism for example appears in anything I write, you can rest assured that yes, that character is intentionally gay or bi.
Interestingly, though, when a protagonist of mine is asexual coded, it has been unintentional every single time, just as I've frequently written characters who are coded as autistic or ADHD without meaning to. For example I showed a work in progress to a classmate, who read it and immediately declared "Oh [main character] TOTALLY has ADHD! Just like me!" He was thrilled! And going back over it I was like "wait... he totally does have problems with his attention span and makes impulsive decisions. He does have ADHD. Huh, go figure."
I'm not formally diagnosed but I'm 99% percent sure I also have ADHD. And since, to me, thinking that way is just the default so there's nothing unusual about a character who keeps daydreaming and is easily distracted when not laser-focused on something. Because isn't everybody like that?
Turns out the answer is no.
If you analysed it without knowing anything about the author, that seems likely. It's not just that my protagonists are usually uninterested in sex and romance unless I make an effort to write them otherwise. It's that sex and romance in everything I write is usually very minimal. Why? Well because for obvious reasons (if you know me) I'm just not interested in writing about that stuff. And when it's focused on to the degree it's focused on in this trilogy, I see it as a boring and unnecessary distraction from the stuff that's actually important. And you know what? Fair enough! The entire world is supposed to be in danger yet we're wasting time on who's screwing who and will Axis marry Faraday in the end blah blah blah. Who CARES?
(no subject)
Sunday, 25 May 2025 18:50 (UTC)Well I meant just within this trilogy, but fair enough! Does Sa'Kuya (why is she called that? Is she Japanese) really count as an important character? She gets a name, yes, but she only appears in maybe two scenes in the entire trilogy.
SCSF: Ah yes, I could have known that. I am just more familiar with the other books for some reason (presumably because they are less bad), and I did want to give some examples... so I think this is an indication that Douglass became less attached to "beauty" over time, which I suspected, but is nice to have confirmed. Oh, and I think Mirbolt the Bane would also fall in this category, though she is a relatively minor character, too.
For Sa'Kuya... she does appear in quite a number of scenes, but her role seems to be limited to "Ho'Demi's wife", so I would certainly not class her as important. (And her name is nothing next to Izanagi, of course!)
Why, thank you! I do try to be as thorough as possible with this.
coding
That is quite interesting! With asexuality, I wonder if that might have something to do with it (still) being rather unknown, so picking up on the coding is harder? For autism and ADHD... I would expect it to be hard to pick up that the way your brain works is different from others; after all, you have to derive it from ways people interact with the world, and doing a direct comparison is quite hard. In any case, it is lovely to see such protagonists!
relationships
(nods) In general, I tend to care less about romance and such than about the other parts, so I am not unhappy to leave the next books for others, then; this one has had a relatively good ratio so far. An occasion where I could see myself be more invested in romance is when it directly ties into the "saving the world" plot (which Douglass notably does with Threshold, where the main character's romantic relationship with another protagonist changes him to such a degree that he becomes quite valuable in defeating the villain; I would not expect that from this trilogy!).
(no subject)
Wednesday, 21 May 2025 11:29 (UTC)Unreasonable, huh? How dare someone want to be safe at home during a bad winter storm? The nerve of this guy...to actually have common sense and avoid weather that could kill you if you're exposed to it for too long. I don't care if they're right there within spitting distance, I would tell them in no uncertain terms that the ferry was closed, come back after the storm passes.
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We get it, Douglass. You really don't need to have every NPC tell us how beautiful the girls are. We figured that out the first dozen times you did it. Plus, it's a little weird that everyone who notices them seems to have the same taste in women. There is no universal standard for beauty, even if you're speaking objectively.
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I can't wait until Yr meets someone who has absolutely no interest in women or sex. It's going to blow her mind. I know Douglass would never let that happen, but it's fun to imagine.
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It's also kind of annoying to imply that the ferryman apparently doesn't have the right to make a living and ask for payment for his passengers. Yes, the price is unreasonable in this case, but I have a feeling that he could have asked for a bottlecap and Timozel would have gotten angry. If he offered to give them a free ride, that would be one thing, since it would be his choice. But for Timozel to demand that he let them cross for free is kind of scummy.
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At least she calls it out as bad behavior. I would half expect her to act like her characters are entitled to free things wherever they go, but I'm not giving her any points for this. She's pissed me off too many times for me to grant her any good will.
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I WON'T.
(no subject)
Wednesday, 21 May 2025 20:25 (UTC)SCSF: Hmmm, that might just be bad phrasing on my part... but then again, he does have three assistants for the weather, and I am quite sure we are supposed to think bad of him for that, so... I think it is. (And I would think a little badly of the ferryman for leaving them out now; the weather is not that bad yet, and it would only take a minute to wait, after all.)
We get it, Douglass. You really don't need to have every NPC tell us how beautiful the girls are. We figured that out the first dozen times you did it. Plus, it's a little weird that everyone who notices them seems to have the same taste in women. There is no universal standard for beauty, even if you're speaking objectively.
I suppose that is an artifact of everyone having to find them beautiful, which just shows why that is a bad idea. And yes, it really does bother me that we are constantly told that; we could use that space to get further ahead with the story, but no...
I can't wait until Yr meets someone who has absolutely no interest in women or sex. It's going to blow her mind. I know Douglass would never let that happen, but it's fun to imagine.
I indeed do not think that will happen, but it would be quite awesome to see! (Of course, from later books, I am quite sure she would be smart enough to resort to other methods to get her way, but still.)
(nods) The scene with Timozel is off enough for me not to give her much credit, either... and given that Faraday specifically asks if "that much force" was necessary, it still feels like it is shown as right of Timozel in a way.
I WON'T.
Neither will I!
Well, thank you for bothering to come by, even on such a very boring part!
(no subject)
Friday, 23 May 2025 11:20 (UTC)I'm not even close to being tall, thin and pale with perfect hair. I'm fat and ruddy-faced with a permanent case of Bad Hair Day. So obviously that's why I'm single, right? Because no man wants me? Wrong. Multiple guys have wanted to be with me (and more than one woman has shown signs of being interested too). I turned them down.
So yeah, the idea that ONLY women who look like them will be considered attractive by everyone they meet is just ridiculous.
How much force does she consider to be okay, then? If Timmy just twisted the guy's wrist a bit would that have been acceptable?
Yes, I was thinking it was a bit sad that I was the only person who commented! Boring or not, I'm making a point of commenting on every instalment to keep the discussion going! And also I don't want you to feel like nobody's reading this because that's really discouraging. It is for me, anyway.
(no subject)
Sunday, 25 May 2025 19:12 (UTC)So yeah, the idea that ONLY women who look like them will be considered attractive by everyone they meet is just ridiculous.
SCSF: Very much so! People will always have differing tastes, after all, and those will include those not considered conventionally attractive.
How much force does she consider to be okay, then? If Timmy just twisted the guy's wrist a bit would that have been acceptable?
I do get that feeling, even though it does not fit with Faraday's behaviour at all... I am relatively certain that Douglass just wanted to show the ferryman get hurt, no matter if she had to twist characterisation for it.
Yes, I was thinking it was a bit sad that I was the only person who commented! Boring or not, I'm making a point of commenting on every instalment to keep the discussion going! And also I don't want you to feel like nobody's reading this because that's really discouraging. It is for me, anyway.
Well, I think that issue has been resolved for this installment by now! I do appreciate you trying to keep The Discussion going, too; this is a first read, after all, and the more feedback I get, the better the second try will be! (And it is just plain fun to talk to others.)
For it being discouraging... knowing that I will get to do this again, and that I have heard some interest from others, it is not quite as discouraging as it could be, and certainly less so than the book itself is. As a side note, those are the reasons why I am still following MG's Scrolls of the Ancients spork, even though it is not all that engaging; that, and I am too stubborn to stop until I have stayed there as long as I promised myself.
(no subject)
Friday, 23 May 2025 11:14 (UTC)But author forbid the "heroes" not get their own way in everything.
Shades of California Angel (feel free to ask for a link to my review) in which even traumatised little children won't stop obsessing over how OMG BEAUTIFUL the self-insert Mary Sue is.
Yeah, that annoys the hell out of me. I had a character get aggressively hit on by an attractive blonde, and he was immediately just not into it and tried to politely turn her down because she's just not his type. It's as simple as that.
Yeah, like if gay guys were actually allowed to exist, sooner or later she'd probably end up hitting on one and losing her shit because why doesn't he want to sleep with her??
He doesn't even give any reasons as to why they should ride for free. Like Faraday is an important noble who's going to freeze to death or something like that.
Me neither, because if Timmy was one of her favourites it would be completely okay for him to go around expecting free shit. It's only because he's a side character who's already been designated as the future Traitor In The Ranks that he's called out on it. If this was Axis, it'd be crickets and tumbleweed. And Axis would have been WAY douchier about it.
Oh, believe me, she hasn't even gotten started in that department.
JOIN THE CLUB I FUCKING HATE HIM.
(no subject)
Friday, 23 May 2025 19:53 (UTC)I'll gladly take a link to it! I've never heard of it before, but I'm intrigued.
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If someone ever writes a spitefic for that, I want to know immediately. That would be hilarious.
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...you don't think anyone would mind if he just...accidentally got pushed into the river, do you? Because I'll volunteer to do it. He hasn't even shown up in a few parts and the very thought of him still pisses me off. Just one little bump and SPLASH.
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WHYYYY must you take that as a personal challenge, Douglass? It wasn't; I promise you it wasn't!
(no subject)
Saturday, 24 May 2025 07:14 (UTC)Here's the original review by Queen of Swords, and Epistler's review.
(no subject)
Saturday, 24 May 2025 10:23 (UTC)(no subject)
Sunday, 25 May 2025 19:14 (UTC)Always there to provide links (and to make use of the actually completed review list)!
(no subject)
Saturday, 24 May 2025 10:23 (UTC)Here ya go! It's embarrassingly awful. https://antishurtugal-reborn.dreamwidth.org/499483.html
Yr had had her eye on him for some time now. Tall, elegantly proportioned, with hair almost as lovely as hers. She decided she had enjoyed the anticipation long enough.
Time for the seduction.
She sat herself down next to him, close enough that her thigh was touching his, and smiled sweetly at him. 'Hello, handsome.'
He (his name was not important) gave her a look. 'Can I help you, miss?'
Yr smiled dazzlingly and flicked her hair back, artful as always. 'I thought you looked a little lonely,' she said, moving even closer.
He pulled away from her. 'Please don't do that. You're making uncomfortable.'
Yr looked blankly at him. 'Excuse me?' She calmed herself and moved in again, pressing herself against his side. 'I think I misheard you,' she said, and started to kiss and nibble at his ear and cheek. 'My little lover...'
He shoved her off and stood up, wiping his cheek. 'What in Artor's name is wrong with you?'
Outraged, Yr stood up too and thrust her luscious breasts toward him - a move which had never failed her before. 'I want you inside me, lover. Ravish me!'
He turned away. 'You're disgusting. And if you don't leave before my boyfriend gets here, you're in big trouble. He's very protective of me.'
Yr's eyes bugged out in horror. "BOYFRIEND?"
Yer welcome. XD
His perfect Sue hair, ruined! Also with any luck he'd subsequently die of hypothermia.
If this spork makes it as far as Sinner you'll be having fantasies about dancing on her grave. Trust me.
(no subject)
Saturday, 24 May 2025 13:05 (UTC)Oh my god, I love it! I can just picture the appalled look on her face, and the smug smiles of every reader who hates her.
(no subject)
Sunday, 25 May 2025 05:17 (UTC)(no subject)
Sunday, 25 May 2025 19:32 (UTC)That's lovely! Could I include it in the fic rec I'm probably giving at the end?
His perfect Sue hair, ruined! Also with any luck he'd subsequently die of hypothermia.
Hmmm, I wouldn't be surprised if he didn't bother to get warm after that, because he'd think it would seem "weak", so maybe he would? And now that you mention his "perfect Sue hair", I'm suddenly reminded of Fellowship of the King; having Axis blind people with his hair does seem like something Douglass might have done, after all!
If this spork makes it as far as Sinner you'll be having fantasies about dancing on her grave. Trust me.
Oh, you can trust I'll do my best to make it that far, and I think I'll probably be feeling the same by then (though I think I'll find Sinner less offensive than the first trilogy). In fact, I'll probably be taking a break after StarMan, just to make sure I'll be reasonably fair to Sinner.
(no subject)
Monday, 26 May 2025 07:03 (UTC)Sure thing!
Given that the guy is Toxic Masculinity on legs, he would absolutely do that.
(no subject)
Monday, 26 May 2025 17:20 (UTC)Good to know!
(no subject)
Sunday, 25 May 2025 19:20 (UTC)He does have to cross the Nordra to go from Smyrton to Sigholt, so an "accident" should be easy to accomplish! (Pity I can't think of anyone who could put him into a Skraeling form; then that'd take care of him forgood...)
(no subject)
Monday, 16 June 2025 22:21 (UTC)Uh, Faraday? Yr? Your travelling companion whom you will shortly be alone with seems to have gone more than a little psychotic. Shouldn't you be concerned about that?
I really don't like how low-key Faraday's feelings on Timozel's newly violent behaviour are. It's good that she recognizes that he's posing a threat to the general populace, but he's already demonstrated either a willingness to kill (grabbing folks by the neck, particularly the front, is a very easy way to kill them) or a rather horrific indifference to the possibility. That should be scary.
Douglass failed hydrology?
I can seeing making the Sign of the Plough over someone as being a way of blessing them, it's a standard use of the Sign of the Cross. That said, I'd expect Timozel to be the one blessing the ferryman since Timozel is a member of a religious order!
(no subject)
Tuesday, 17 June 2025 20:25 (UTC)SCSF: Faraday does think about this in the last part of the chapter, but her thoughts are rather like "maybe Yr is taking this too far" than "maybe she should not be seducing people", and the tone I am getting is something like "she should not be doing it, but if does not cause trouble, we will let her". So I think you are quite right in your assessment. (And I note that no one seems to have told her yet that she should not be doing this at Gorkenfort, a warning that would not be out of place.)
Faraday's reaction
(nods) It would fit if Timozel had... maybe thrown him in the river? Given the several assistants, that would not be nearly as bad, at least. In the current situation, she should be demanding to know what is going on with him, and telling him never to do that again. As it is... I think I know why Douglass did it, but it only gave her complete nonsense as a result.
Douglass failed hydrology?
I think so! I would probably not have complained about this if the rest of the chapter was not so boring, but next book, her poor understanding of hydrology will ruin a somewhat important plot point. I think we will have a lot to say on how that is wrong...
Ah, thank you for the correction. Come to think of it, that could be as good a way to start a conflict as the one Douglass went with: Timozel assumes that the ferryman made it to ward off evil and takes offense. It would not make that much sense, but it would require Timozel to be less out of character, at least?